Sunday, November 16, 2008

Responding to my Reading with my Reactions to my blogging brothers

Some of you may read my blog and not realize the reason I started this thing to begin with. This started as an idea between Nate Duriga, Austin Surls, and myself as a way of dialoguing and sharing ideas about Theology and the Bible. Everyone else is MORE than welcome to join in on the dialogue. Austin invited several of his old Masters buddies to join in and there is always room for more. As this blogging community grows this will become more difficult, but for now I am going to react to each of their blogs once a week (on Sunday) and post my thoughts on their thoughts here. So without further chit chat, here are my responses to their latest blogs.

Nate's last few blogs
have focused much on the persecution of Christians around the world and the effect our political decisions have upon world hunger. These reminders are good for us and much appreciated. Life is so easy for us here and apathy comes very naturally. If our friends and family were being killed or were starving to death (not to mention if WE were) it would matter much more to us. We would probably more readily make sacrifices for their well-being. But this is very bad theology. These are our brothers and sisters! This family called the church is more important than the physical family into which we were born. Those relationships are temporary. The relationship we have with each other through Jesus Christ is everlasting. We have do not have more obligation to our American brothers than we do to our African brothers. Ignorance and apathy are normal and easy but unacceptable.

Austin Surls' blog asks the question: "How should we use the word "religion"" This is a very good question and it kind of bothers me as well. (btw the following is basically the same as I posted under the comment section of his post, you dont have to read both!)My pastor uses the phrase all the time: "Christianity is not a religion, its a relationship." But is that really true? And what is religion? And what do people HEAR when you say religion? The second question is probably the most important and the most difficult. I think Christianity is actually a religion. James says "...pure and undefiled religion before God is this..." Paul on Mars Hill doesn't try and argue that Christianity is in a different category than their false gods but answers their unanswered questions and that the true God is completely different 'god' and with different expectations than they would have believed. But I think that the difficulty is understanding what people in your coffee shop think of when they think of religion. I think people think of religion as not having any correspondence to truth or reality. Its just an feel good thing. It doesn't demand or require anything of you. So if saying that Christianity is a religion communicates something different than what Christianity really is, should we use the term? Hmmm... But is Christianity only a relationship? And what do people hear when you say that? Unfortunately I think that we will run into the same issues. What does it mean to say you have a relationship with God (for your hearers)? I don't think this communicates what you want it to mean either. Does worldview do better? I'm not sure it's perfect because it doesn't communicate the obligations that a relationship with God requires. Ultimately I'm not sure I'm helping you a lot. Can you say that you have a relationship with God that changes the way you view the world? Or is that too long... and still incomplete? I'll just say that I don't think that defining Christianity as a relationship with God is any better (and maybe worse) than calling it a religion.

As more blogs join our blogging community I'll respond to their thoughts as well. I enjoy this dialogue! Thanks Nate for your response. I wish I knew how to exactly draw lines on applying these issues without spiraling into legalism. So hard!

Richey

16 comments:

ElderChild said...

"Pure And Undefiled Religion"

"Pure religion and undefiled before GOD The Father is this, to visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction and to keep oneself uncontaminated by the world." (James 1:27)

Simply, all other religion is impure and defiled!

Faith will not create a system of religion.......

Hope is there would be those who take heed unto The Call of The Only True GOD to "Come Out of her, MY people"!

For they will "Come Out" of this wicked world(babylon) and it's systems of religion, into "the glorious Liberty of The Children of The Only True GOD".

They will no longer be of those who are destroying the earth(land, air, water, vegetation, creatures)" and perverting that which is Spirit(Light, Truth, Life, Love, Peace, Hope, Faith, Mercy, Grace, Miracles, etc.).

Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(religion) that is of this world, for "the WHOLE world is under the control of the evil one" (1John5:19) indeed and Truth.......

Truth is never ending.......
thedestructionoftheearth.wordpress.com

faithbornfromdoubt said...

This guy (elderchild) copied and pasted from his own blog (I looked!)... how irritating are these guys who just blow through your blog without really interacting. cluttering us with the irrelevant smatterings of their own loosely conceived opinions that fail to actually engage the topic at hand?!

Do you guys just google certain phrases that you want to go off on?

If you won't engage- don't bother

Nicely,
Richey

ElderChild said...

Engage? Most certainly.

Simply, "christianity" is Anti-Messiah.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

All right... cool! you came back... let's engage. You're going to have to help me out. I have absolutely no clue what you mean. What is "Christianity" and what do you mean by "anti-messiah"? Do you believe that all who call themselves Christians are part of a false religion? Is it the 'church' that you have a problem with (are you a campingite?) or something else? Are you calling me to come out of Babylon or do you just think I should better define my terms? I may be slow but I cannot figure out anything of what you are trying to say. Help me out and I'll respond.

engaging,
Richey

ElderChild said...

The following should answer your questions. Also there are two blog sites where i have posted that which i have "seen and heard".

ASimpleAndSpiritualLife.blogspot.com

TheDesructionOfTheEarth.wordpress.com

DISCLAIMER: The following testimony is given regarding the religious systems of this wicked world, not individuals. Recorded for revelation, not condemnation, in hopes there would be those who would "see" and "hear", for all who do so will "come out from among them(this world and it's systems of religion) and be separate". They will "Come out of her" indeed and Truth!

"The Way of Truth is evil spoken of" because of pagan "catholicism" and her harlot pagan "christian" daughters ;-(

Their "imag"ined "jesus christ" is not The Messiah! It was some five hundred years ago that they named one head of their three-headed pagan "god", "jesus", during a time that has been called the "reformation". Prior to that time there was no "j" sound in the english language.......

Yet the "reformation" was an aptly named time! For it was a time when "catholicism" birthed her harlot "christian" daughters ;-( Her "christian" daughters are of her substance ;-( Her substance was merely "reformed" so that her "christian" daughters might appear a bit differently outwardly, yet inwardly they remained liken unto their pagan harlot mother ;-(

"christianity" is but the byproduct of the fornicative relationship pagan "catholicism" has always had with "the god of this world", he who is "the father of lies", he who is "the angel of light", 'd'evil spirit that rules over this wicked world ;-(
All religious systems, muslin, jewish, buddhist, catholic, christian ,,etc,, are Anti-Messiah!

Religious systems of this world, all alike they are,
Their captives have fought, killed and died, both near and far ;-(

And then once a week, or multiple times a day they may pray,
Yet as hypocrites they begin each new day ;-(

Days that are filled with deceit and lies,
For in a "religious system" Truth can not abide ;-(

And so the fruit of death is born of religion's way,
Because life is but a pawn in the wicked game they play ;-(

Faith will not create a religious system!

The Messiah testified of a "wicked world", and of His disciples being "in, not of, this world".

John exhorted those who believed "to love not the world or it's things" for "the WHOLE world is under the control of the evil one"!

And James testified, "whoever is a friend of this world is the enemy of GOD(Father, Great Spirit, Creator,,)"!

Those of this wicked world and it's religious systems are destroying and perverting Creation and The Creator, Our Father, has promised that HE "will destroy those who are destroying and perverting HIS Creation(earth, air, water, creatures, Truth, Love, Peace, .etc.)"!

Hope is that there would be those who take heed unto The Call of The Only True GOD and "Come out of her, MY people"!

All who heed GOD's Call will exit "the broadway to destruction" and they will follow The Messiah on "The Way to The Truth of The Life"! They no longer will have their portion with the pagan "catholic" and "christian" LIES, or with any other religious system of this world.

The Messiah testified, "whoever lives and believes in Me(His Teachings and Life example) shall never die." And then The Messiah questioned, "Do you believe this?" YES!

And you? Do you believe? Or do you believe in death?

While there is breath(spirit) there is hope!

For Miracles Do Happen!

Thankfully so!

Hope is that there would be those who "come out" of the "strong delusion" that is the religious systems of this wicked world. Hope is that there would be those who believe in and receive of The Life. Hope is that there would be those who would "experience The Messiah and The Power that raised Him from among the dead".

Hope is you will, or have experienced The Miracle that is receiving "a love of The Truth".

All who have received "a love of The Truth" will have:

Peace, in spite of the dis-ease(no-peace) that is of this wicked world, for "the WHOLE world is under the control of the evil one" indeed and Truth! (1 John 5:19) .......

Truth is never ending.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

I think I am probably wasting my time with this, but one more chance. No more copy and paste. Think! Read, reflect, consider, evaluate, engage, and then reply! Your copy/paste material in incoherent and does not interact with what I or anyone else has written.

You are wrong that 'Jesus was invented 500 years ago', but I don't think you are the type of person to actually listen and consider anyone else's words. If you want to argue this point instead of copy paste then we can discuss it but I doubt we'll do that.

For starters, define (don't go off for 300 paragraphs!) some terms for me:
religion, Messiah, Christianity, truth.

And tell me, please, where is your source for truth? Did God speak to you? Do you make this stuff up? The Bible is it God's word? (or just part of it or just whatever you like of it?) Is there one way to God or many?

If you copy and paste anything I'm done with this...

Richey

ElderChild said...

Simply, sad for you ;-(

Quite obvious that religion has had it's way with you ;-(

Yet there is hope!

For Miracles do happen!

Hope is that one day you would experience The Miracle that is receiving "the love of The Truth" for only then will you take heed unto The Call of The Only True GOD to "Come Out of her, MY people".......

Truth is never ending.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

So asking for clarity is bad... Asking for definition is bad... I have no idea what kind of 'truth' you're selling but I don't think I want any. I am willing to dialogue with anyone who wishes to do so but you have to be able to have a real conversation.

Until then, I hope you look for truth that is outside of yourself, because, like me, you need it desperately.

Bren said...

wow. i think i need someone with the gift of interpretation to translate much of what was spoken here.

ElderChild said...

Simply, Truth must be received and experienced, and will not be received and experienced by those who have not received "the love of The Truth".......

Quite obvious that you yet believe in debate, discussion, theo'ry'logy, and other means to arrive at your version of "truth" ;-(

Such is the way of the religions of this world for they are led of those who with "good words and fair speech deceive the hearts of the simple" ;-(

Sadly, education, both secular and religious, most certainly plays it's part in the destruction of the earth, and the perversion of that which is Spirit, for "educaton" has bedeviled mankind into believing that he knows what is best even as he see's that his knowledge, falsely so-called, is responsible for:

thedestructionoftheearth.wordpress.com ;-( and the perversion of that which is Spirit ;-(

Yet there is hope.......

For Miracles do happen.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

so in order to know the 'truth' one must turn off his brain... interesting

truth is not found within yourself man. truth is found in Jesus Christ.

ElderChild said...

So sad for the young men of this day for they have been led astray just as Isaiah prophesied:

"There will come a time when women will rule over men and children will be their oppressors, for they which lead them will cause them to err......."

Hopefully one day you would experience The Miracle that is "The Messiah in you the hope of glory".......

However that will not happen until you "see" your need to receive "the love of The Truth".......

Truth is never ending.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

first off, I want to apologize for my sarcasm. I don't want to be a jerk online just because I can be.

secondly I really honestly have no clue what anything you say 'means'. If I don't know what you mean I can't really interact with it. We are speaking different languages. But if you continue down this road I have to quit because I really have no clue what you mean about anything.

thirdly, dialogue is worthless unless we are both willing to learn from each other. If you have something you can teach me, I am willing to learn. But you have to be willing to accept the fact that you may also be wrong about something(s).

Elderchild, do you think we can dialogue or is this thing over? I'll let you decide.

Thanks
Matt

ElderChild said...

You have already "told me" where i was wrong and my answer apparently revealed that you were wrong in what you "told me".......

And that is the problem with "telling someone" rather than "sharing that which you have seen(experienced) and heard(received)".......

The source of "telling someone" is usually some'thing' one has read and/or studied ;-(

And so it is with the catholic/chrisitan systems of theo'ry'logical religion ;-(

Just go to a seminary(cemetery), study their theo'ry'logy and now you can "tell" others ;-( Oh, yes, there are some who stay at home and study, and then seek to "tell" others what they have read and studied, yet?

Question is "tell them WHAT"?

Sadly, nothing but "the colored marks written on a dead tree" that were bound in a book memorized by the mind of a man, not written on the fleshly tables of a heart circumcized by Faith ;-(

Yet there is hope.......

For Miracles do happen.......

Hope is there would be those who take heed unto The Call of The Only True GOD to "Come out of her, MY people" for they will flee bablyon(this world) and it's systems of religion.......

Truth is never ending.......

faithbornfromdoubt said...

Methinks your 'faith' is the most dangerous kind of 'faith' that there is. All of your truth is found in yourself and you ultimately worship yourself. No one who knows more than you can correct you because you listen to no ideas just experiences. Basing truth upon experience alone will lead each of us to different 'truths' and we will all worship ourselves. Truth is consistent and coherent. Worshiping yourself may feel good but it puts you in direct opposition with a jealous God. This will only bring judgment.

I hope you can realize your need for someone else's help to rescue you from yourself and your sin.

I don't think I have anything more to say. I hope the best for you, that you come to a knowledge of the Truth and that it breaks you from the bondage of self-worship.

ElderChild said...

Quite obvious that religion has had it's way with you ;-(

Simply, sad for you and all who deny "the glorious Liberty given the children of The Only True GOD" ;-(

Such is the way of the pharisee ;-(

Yet there is hope.......

For Miracles do happen.......

Hope is there would be those who experience The Miracle that is receiving "the love of The Truth" for they will take heed unto The Call of The Only True GOD to "Come out of her, MY people".......

All who receive "the love of The Truth" will "Come out" of babylon(this world) and it's systems of religion for "the WHOLE world is under the control of the evil one" indeed and Truth.......

Truth is never ending.......

About Me

My photo
Tacoma, Washington, United States
"It is not as a child that I believe and confess Jesus Christ. My hosanna is born of a furnace of doubt." Fyodor Dostoevsky. I'm a Northwest Baptist Seminary graduate (MDiv) and current student (ThM). I plan on someday going to Africa and teach Bible and Theology at a Bible College or Seminary level. I hope to continue my studies and earn a PhD, either after I go to overseas for a few years or before. I'm a theological conservative, but I like to think outside of the box and challenge conventional thinking and consider myself a free thinker. I am currently serving in my fourth year as a Youth Pastor at Prairie Baptist Fellowship in Yelm Washington. My blogs will reflect my thoughts on both seminary and ministry life, though not (of course) exclusively. I enjoy literature and occasionally try my hand at writing stories and poems. "For I am not ashamed of the gospel for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes..." Paul

This Day in History